Page: 1 2
Mike Kamm
Registered user
Global user
Registered: 07-2004
Location: Averill Park, NY
Posts: 4480
Karma: 17 (+18/-1)
|
|
Reply | Quote
|
|
Modern oils not good for old engines!
Has anyone noticed that in pursuit of lower emissions that the formulation of engine oils have been changed in recent years? If not, I urge you to read THIS article called "When Good Cams Go Bad".
It’s more than a coincidence that engine builders have experienced more flat tappet cam failures in the last few years than at any point prior. And that’s because today’s engine oil has a lower amount of anti-wear additives than your flat tappet cam requires in order to keep it spinning freely.
Experts say that the reasons behind the changes in engine oil are numerous, but one of the main reasons is that the American Petroleum Institute (API) has regulated the amount of zinc levels to .08 percent, down from .15 of a few years ago (and even higher levels before that) due to its harmful effects on catalytic converters and emissions systems. For the same reasons, phosphorous levels have also been severely reduced.
What to do? You can use Shell Rotella diesel oil, because it does not have reduced amounts of zinc and phosphorous. But then you're stuck running thicker 15W-40 oil, which wastes fuel and is not recommended for modern gas engines. However, there are numerous companies that sell additives to put these important ingredients back into your oil for your old flat tappet equipped engines.
Why am I making you aware of this? The fresh 1608cc engine just removed from my B210 has developed a nasty valve tap lately and has quite a bit of lash on a few valves. It has a flat tappet cam and I've been running regular motor oil in it. What do you think is wrong with it? 
Last edited by Mike Kamm, 9/29/2008, 7:17 am
---
Race Here, Race Now!
|
|
9/28/2008, 9:19 pm
|
Send Email to Mike Kamm
Send PM to Mike Kamm
|
Dave 48
Registered user
Global user
Registered: 11-2007
Posts: 289
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)
|
|
Reply | Quote
|
|
Re: Modern oils not good for old engines!
We have been using the Rotella in all the old Citroen flat tappet cam engines. The new oils seem to be fine for a pressure lubed over head cam. Thanks for posting it Mike there may be people that have not realized this yet.
Dave B
|
|
9/29/2008, 7:08 am
|
Send Email to Dave 48
Send PM to Dave 48
|
Bryon 96A
Registered user
Global user
Registered: 07-2004
Posts: 185
Karma: 1 (+1/-0)
|
|
Reply | Quote
|
|
Re: Modern oils not good for old engines!
I have heard of this, I use 5-40 Rotella synthetic in everything. **** Vedder is an Amsoil distrbutor and would know if this is true.
Bryon 96A
|
|
9/29/2008, 7:15 am
|
Send Email to Bryon 96A
Send PM to Bryon 96A
|
Dave 48
Registered user
Global user
Registered: 11-2007
Posts: 289
Karma: 0 (+0/-0)
|
|
Reply | Quote
|
|
Re: Modern oils not good for old engines!
Just in case, the Amsoil, Red line, and Royal Purple synthetics all have lots of the good stuff in them there only draw back is price. If your oils have an SM rating they are lacking the good stuff.
Dave
|
|
9/29/2008, 7:35 am
|
Send Email to Dave 48
Send PM to Dave 48
|
ZX2 2000
Registered user
Global user
Registered: 07-2004
Posts: 795
Karma: 5 (+5/-0)
|
|
Reply | Quote
|
|
Re: Modern oils not good for old engines!
Actually, this is rather old. Most of all the problems have been covered.
I discussed this with Amsoil and they said that their oil is OK to use.
As I understand it any API SM/CF oil is OK and API SL/CF, which is diesel and racing oil is OK also.
If I remember correctly, this problem occured primarily on vintage engines.
Dik V.
---
Dick Vedder SL #1
|
|
9/29/2008, 9:22 am
|
Send Email to ZX2 2000
Send PM to ZX2 2000
|
Mike Kamm
Registered user
Global user
Registered: 07-2004
Location: Averill Park, NY
Posts: 4480
Karma: 17 (+18/-1)
|
|
Reply | Quote
|
|
Re: Modern oils not good for old engines!
quote:
Dave 48 wrote:
Just in case, the Amsoil, Red line, and Royal Purple synthetics all have lots of the good stuff in them there only draw back is price. If your oils have an SM rating they are lacking the good stuff.
Dave
Thanks Dave, I just got back from Advance Auto and looked at the oil they had there. Yes, all of the regular oils are now SM rated. This is important to realize if you own and older flat tappet equipped car. It's a good thing I am just now waking up to this because I am about to change the oil in my F150. I definately don't feel like replacing the camshaft and lifters in that.
I saw some crazy high prices for motor oil there. Brand name oils are like $4.00 a quart now. This is for regular oil! The synthetics start at $6.50 and go up to $7.99 for the Royal Purple.
Man am I glad I stocked up on Valvoline SYN oil six months ago when it was buy one get one free at Advance Auto. It's got an SM/SL, and CF rating. Some of you may remember it, I posted about it here. Its regular price then was $5.48 a quart. Now it's a dollar more!
---
Race Here, Race Now!
|
|
9/29/2008, 9:55 am
|
Send Email to Mike Kamm
Send PM to Mike Kamm
|
Mike Kamm
Registered user
Global user
Registered: 07-2004
Location: Averill Park, NY
Posts: 4480
Karma: 17 (+18/-1)
|
|
Reply | Quote
|
|
Re: Modern oils not good for old engines!
quote:
ZX2 2000 wrote:
Actually, this is rather old. Most of all the problems have been covered.
Thanks Richard. I read that this all started in 2006. Amsoil may have the problems covered, but for those who are not paying attention and using regular SM rated oil, be forewarned.
---
Race Here, Race Now!
|
|
9/29/2008, 9:59 am
|
Send Email to Mike Kamm
Send PM to Mike Kamm
|
Mike Kamm
Registered user
Global user
Registered: 07-2004
Location: Averill Park, NY
Posts: 4480
Karma: 17 (+18/-1)
|
|
Reply | Quote
|
|
Re: Modern oils not good for old engines!
I got a quick education yesterday regarding oil type requirements for the new "clean" turbo diesel engines. In this case we're talking about the new 2008 Dodge [Mercedes Benz] Sprinters. We have two of them at work and I did the first oil changes on them. There is a sticker on the valve cover that says something like "Don't add any amount of the incorrect type oil into this engine. Damage will occur - See owner's manual".
Seems the Mobil 1 "Truck and SUV" 5W-30 I was about to pour in is wrong for this application. Turns out you need a "European" spec oil that meets certain "MB" [Merecedes Benz] specifications. They require a specific low-ash formula oil to help reduce build-up in the exhaust filters. The manual lists about 10 different brands and specific rated oils but none of them are on the shelf at WalMart or most stores. I went into Auto Zone and was able to find Castrol Syntec 5W-40 that has the correct spec, but these Sprinters take 12 quarts and they only had nine!  I ended up with using Mobil-1 0W-40, but again they only had enough for one truck. I actually had to order engine oil for the other truck!
---
Race Here, Race Now!
|
|
10/17/2008, 7:51 am
|
Send Email to Mike Kamm
Send PM to Mike Kamm
|
chutch84
Registered user
Global user
Registered: 07-2004
Posts: 894
Karma: 7 (+8/-1)
|
|
Reply | Quote
|
|
Re: Modern oils not good for old engines!
Hmmmm??? I have yet to change the oil in my New 2008 Dodge 5500 diesel. it has the Cummins engine but does not say Blu-tec anywhere's. It is actually a Freightliner Chassis with a Dodge Cab.
Geuss i'll take a look this afternoon.
Claude
|
|
10/17/2008, 11:46 am
|
Send Email to chutch84
Send PM to chutch84
|
Bill Lass
Registered user
Global user
Registered: 02-2006
Posts: 12
Karma: 1 (+1/-0)
|
|
Reply | Quote
|
|
Re: Modern oils not good for old engines!
Your local SAAB dealer has 0W40 mobil1 euro spec. mb-approval 229.5 api sm,sl/cf. But your specs say MB sheet 229.51 approved oils; low ash long life
Mercedes pioneered this new spec for passenger cars with diesel engines with exhaust particulate filters, and gasoline engines, and longer service life than the 229.31 oils. The spec was introduced in 2005. Change intervals increased to 20,000 kilometers. Based on ACEA A3 B4 and C3.
perhaps not good enough?
Bill
|
|
10/17/2008, 3:36 pm
|
Send Email to Bill Lass
Send PM to Bill Lass
|
Add a reply
Page: 1 2
Powered by AkBBS 0.9.5b - Link to us
- Blogs
- Hall of Honour
- Chat
Click here to get your own free message board
|
You are not logged in (login)
Board's time is: 12/2/2008, 3:35 am
|
|
|
