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GaleB
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James 4;1-10, NIV
James 4:1-10
"1 What causes wars, and what causes fightings among you? Is it not your passions that are at war in your members?
2 You desire and do not have; so you kill. And you covet and cannot obtain; so you fight and wage war. Your do not have, because you do not ask.
3 You ask and do not receive, because you ask wrongly, to spend it on your passions."
We will stop here in this section of study for discussion and reflection ...
Please add your comments or discussion.
Thank you Lord for this time in your word.
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8/22/2008, 6:19 am
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GaleB
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Re: James 4;1-10, NIV
Somethings to ponder:
ref.Trinity Bible Study
James now turns his thoughts from living in this peace of Christ to the root of our conflicts with one another. "What causes wars, and what causes fightings among you?" he asks. James answers his question with a rhetorical question, "Is it not your passions that are at war in your members?"
The wars or conflicts between us are due to our passions that are at conflict.
James can be referring to have conflicting interests or concerns between us and others around us.
The conflict between Israel and Palestine is due to a conflicting passion for the same land. But, I think he is also referring to the conflict within ourselves.
We have warring passions within ourselves, don't we? The desire for security, well-being, wealth, possessions, good relationships, etc. can all battle within us for supremacy especially if the fear/anxiety factor is high. Our desire for both intimacy and independence from others can lead us to send mixed messages because we are mixed ourselves as to what exactly we want from this or that relationship.
The internal conflict heightens our insecurity and so leads us to take more extreme measures in our relationships with others. We have conflict within ourselves and we collide with the passions of others when we interact.
Our passions or desires tempt us to believe we need to possess, obtain, or control in order to have peace. But these lead instead to destruction and discontent. "You desire and do not have; so you kill. And you covet and cannot obtain; so you fight and wage war."
As we have noted before, James is writing to people who find themselves in a variety of trials due to being forced from their homelands because of persecution.
Obviously, when we are in difficult circumstances, our desires for peace, well-being, good relationships, success, etc. are not being met by our immediate circumstances.
We desire, covet, or envy and cannot have or obtain. So our solution is to kill, to destroy, or to fight others.
I hope this is not way too long...
Last edited by GaleB, 8/22/2008, 6:37 pm
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8/22/2008, 6:36 pm
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ket85rn
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Re: James 4;1-10, NIV
not too long when it is well spaced...
Very insightful. A tough topic...
I think the internal struggle is key to our conflicts with others. I know in my life it is the "conversations" I have in my own head that seem to lead to more problems. I think we often make assumptions about what others think or feel based on what we are feeling inside at that time, and that cant' help but surface in our dealings with others and we end up in conflict.
Am i making any sense?...
Karen
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8/23/2008, 1:49 pm
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GaleB
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Re: James 4;1-10, NIV
Absolutely Karen. You are showing maturity in your response.
You are on target . So often, we get *caught up* in the external events, stressing us, rather than realizing, the internal conflicts. We are all, every one of us guilty . James was expressing this concern to the people.
I don't think I ever gave much thought to this internal strugggle, until this study.It is so true...
Anyone else care to elaborate ?
Thanks Karen , I appreciate you so much!
Gale
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8/23/2008, 3:04 pm
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GaleB
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Re: James 4;1-10, NIV
Another thought provoker.
I think we can expand James' statement about killing beyond actually taking someone else's life.
Our envy of others can lead us to kill our relationship with them, to gossip about them to others in an effort to "kill" their reputation, or simply to "kill" our feelings towards them because we are so unhappy that they have it better than we do.
It is impossible to be peaceful and content when envy and jealousy are at work in us.
We may try to tell ourselves that it is not fair the way our lives are now and we have a "right" to make getting what we want a priority.
But this justification does not really improve our situation but makes it worse in deeper ways.
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8/23/2008, 3:16 pm
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horseshadowrider
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Re: James 4;1-10, NIV
Gale, very wise words. You spoke right to my heart in a certain situation I personally am dealing with. Thank you.
We war continually, it seems, between human nature and Godly nature. BEtween good and evil. Between good choices and bad decisions.
James says we do not have because we do not ask. Does he mean asking for "things?"
Perhaps he is again referring back to the wisdom of God we can have if we but ask for it.
And that wisdom would govern our choices, our decisions, our thoughts and actions.
And we'd stop warring within ourselves.
So much in these verses. Thanks everyone!
---
Virginia
4 plc fracture of the C1, Tethered Cord, (acquired chiari and elongated brainstem resolved by Tethered Cord surgery); atlanto occipital dislocation and cranial settling all due to equestrian accident,
2004. CC Fusion upcoming.
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8/23/2008, 9:58 pm
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GaleB
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Re: James 4;1-10, NIV
Virginia, thank you so much for sharing . I hope your situation, you are dealing with, comes to a healthy conclusion.
You are right V. We do constantly have the internal war of good vs. evil. Gosh how cleaver that evil one is too. Disguising itself so well. Fitting to our wants, desires, and lusts.
In response to your question about why we do not have... from the study:
This next section is very interesting. James goes on to tell his readers, "You do not have, because you do not ask.
You ask and do not receive, because you ask wrongly, to spend it on your passions."
The reason they do not have, James says, is not because they have failed in their efforts to obtain or possess things on their own, but because they either have not asked or have asked only to have their passions satisfied.
This seems to mean then that first of all God intends for us to receive what we need by asking Him.
He is our Father and the One from whom "every good endowment and every perfect gift" comes from (1:17).
He can be thoroughly trusted to know what we need, even more than we know.
He is "the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change."
Does He see us in our struggles, does He care?
Yes, James has already assured them that this God "brought us forth by the word of truth that we should be a kind of first fruits of his creatures."(1:18)
The greater glory God has for us is that we receive from His hand His loving, transforming work in our lives.
We cannot easily receive from God what He desires to give us when we are busy attempting to obtain or fulfill our own passions.
How can we receive His peace, love, and even joy in the midst of our daily lives when we are focusing on pursuing getting from others what we are convinced we need to be secure or to escape our troubles?"
This section of James carries a lot of meat so to speak. We spent more time in the Bible study here in this section too.
My hope is, we will gain new wisdom from this study before we continue.
God Bless you Virginia, you mean so much to me too. Thank you for adding your thoughts and insight.
Gale
Last edited by GaleB, 8/23/2008, 10:35 pm
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8/23/2008, 10:24 pm
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Joleen711
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Re: James 4;1-10, NIV
I am a little late posting but wanted to share..I hope that is ok.
We are continually at war in one way or another. Through centuries throughout the Bible there are many places where war played its part in our history.
Lot and Abraham,at Corinth brethern were suing each other and on and on. Many places showed some sort of friction or "war".
I was studying tonight and came across where they talked about different kinds of wars. And James shows us that there are:
Class wars - 2:1-9
2. Employment wars - 5:1-6
3. Church fights - 1:19-20; 3:13-18
4. Personal wars
a. Notice 4:11-12
b. Where we are admonished not to speak evil of one another,nor to judge (condemn) one another. Which means that we can easily be at war with one another.
Why is that? Because our desires are in our hearts. We let our emotions rule how we act. We let our desires for things to satisfy our pleasures. Basically selfishness.
That leads us to wrong actions based on feelings. Wrongful prayer which leads to unanswered selfish prayers. And it (the war) always starts in ourselves.
Why are we at war with ourselves is because we are at war with God. James shows us that there is 3 enemies in which cause us war with God.
one- the world
two-flesh
third-devil and tempations
more in next post...sorry so long,love, jOleen
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8/28/2008, 12:02 am
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Joleen711
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Re: James 4;1-10, NIV
james tells us in verses 7-10 that to keep in Gods Word, to walk with God you have to have unconditional surrender to God to be victorious.
Submission being no my will, but Gods will be done. Humble yourself and draw Him closer to you. Purify our hearts.
I also read a note that was a wow note:
To truly mourn your sins and repent in humility. It's possible to submit outwardly and not be humble inwardly. Wow.
Only then will the "wars"cease.
As Solomon wrote in the Book of Proverbs:
When a man's ways please the LORD, he maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him. Proverbs 16:7
This is an amazing study and I , myself have learned so much so far. Thank you for letting me share on my end. Love you all, Joleen
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8/28/2008, 12:12 am
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horseshadowrider
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Re: James 4;1-10, NIV
Really deep and insightful observations, Joleen. Sooo good to have you back. Thank you for all of this, it is truly all so true. It all starts within our hearts!
love you
V.
---
Virginia
4 plc fracture of the C1, Tethered Cord, (acquired chiari and elongated brainstem resolved by Tethered Cord surgery); atlanto occipital dislocation and cranial settling all due to equestrian accident,
2004. CC Fusion upcoming.
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8/28/2008, 12:35 am
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