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CodSkip
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Reopening a can of worms?

Ok, I'm sure plenty will shout at me, call me a loser or whatever, but does anyone have any reasoned opinion on the Cup format?

Once again, we were entered into a competition we realistically have little hope of ever getting near winning and where the rules make it nigh on impossible for us to get anything like a competitive side out.

I am still mystified as to why the cups aren't based on ability. At present we have a scenario where a 1st team from the prem can play a 1st team from Div 4. Likewise, a 3rd team from div 2 can play a 3rd team from Div 6.

I appreciate some will talk about giant killing and the magic of the cup. Thing is, this isn't 90 minutes of football, its 5 hours of cricket and there is much more of a tendency with cricket for quality to win through. The reality is, each year, I struggle to get a side out and invariably get stuffed by a much stronger outfit.

There either needs to be a levelling out of ability, or a relaxation of the rules. I know people will say, well you can't have VC 1's playing VC2's.... well, why not? if they get drawn against each other, so what??? I'm sure the VC2 boys would love a crack at their 1's. and you can hardly cheat can you??? One side will go out so where's the benefit in manipulating the sides?

alternatively, why can't the rules say that a certain number of players, say a maximum of four, from a senior side CAN play. make it juniors only if necessary. anything to allow smaller clubs a chance to level the playing field. and yes, in PS terms, we are a SMALL club, as our NL affiliation actually works against us rather than for us.

I'm amazed no one can see how the cup comps are geared towards making life as easy for the big PS team's who's 3 or 4 teams are sandwiched in the top 3 or four divisions. I give them respect for being good teams, with good set ups, good juniors etc. Fair play to them. These teams are good enough not to need protection to win cups. At the moment though, you can bet your bottom dollar that VC, F&B and probably GT Ecc will have major interests in this years finals. Don't get me wrong, if they win the games, they deserve the place and I wish them well. I've no beef with the teams or clubs concerned. but lets be honest, the cup formats don't exactly hinder them do they???

For those who think I'm whinging, fair enough, whatever. You maybe belong to one of the clubs I mentioned and think I'm just having a dig. For those that type "yawn" well I'm sorry if this issue is to complex, or there are too many words to comprehend.

Thing is, I might advocate a springfields next year, and not even bother turning up, that's how pointless i think our particular cup is. Now we may not ever win it, even if it was more ability based, but at least we'd think we had a fighting chance........

28/Apr/2008, 9:24 am

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johnnytwldcc
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Re: Reopening a can of worms?

I totally agree with you CodSkip. We played Norcross yesterday and struggled to put out a competitive side. In fact, the side included 2 under 13's, and under 15 and 4 players playing their first game of the season. As a result, we only managed 42 runs. Instead of having a 1st XI, 2nd XI and 3rd XI cup, why dont we have cups for Prem and Div 1, Div 2 and Div 3, and then Divs 4 - 6. At least that way, the teams would be more evenly matched.

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28/Apr/2008, 9:38 am

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johnnytwldcc
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Re: Reopening a can of worms?

I totally agree with you CodSkip. We played Norcross yesterday and struggled to put out a competitive side. In fact, the side included 2 under 13's, an under 15 and 4 players playing their first game of the season. As a result, we only managed 42 runs. Instead of having a 1st XI, 2nd XI and 3rd XI cup, why dont we have cups for Prem and Div 1, Div 2 and Div 3, and then Divs 4 - 6. At least that way, the teams would be more evenly matched.

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28/Apr/2008, 9:38 am

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CodSkip
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Re: Reopening a can of worms?

Thank you Johnny! emoticon

You do realise though that would mean that certain clubs would only have a chance of winning 2 cup comps though, and for that reason, it will probably never happen.

No we'll soldier on with one cup with 30 odd sides in, one with 20 odd and one with 12 or whatever it is.

In fact, let's have another cup for the two fourth teams, then VC will be able to get their name on another trophy! hehe

Tongue placed firmly in cheek there... TCCC would beat them anyway! emoticon

I'll have to stop now as it seems like VC bashing and that's not what I'm intending. We played their fourths this year and they were a thoroughly decent bunch, not in any way arrogant or anything similar.

I'm actually trying to make a serious point...

28/Apr/2008, 9:49 am

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Walter70
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Re: Reopening a can of worms?

Codskip - First and foremost, dont see your comments as a whinge, as I fully appreciate your frustration.

However, I cannot share your viewpoint at all. The League competition is there for sides to compete at a similar level of ability.

Cup competitions are there to pitch the "minnow" against the much stronger side. This isnt any different from the side that finishes fourth in the PS coming up against the Northern League Champions. It presents a fair gulf in abilities, but I certainly welcomed the opportunity to play against the better sides from around the county.

True enough you might well get gubbed, but all good experience for me. Is it not a good opportunity to test yourself once in a while ?

28/Apr/2008, 10:01 am

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johnnytwldcc
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Re: Reopening a can of worms?

It is good to test your abilities against better teams walt, but when you struggle to get a team out against a quality side and then to get carted to all parts, especially if you are a youngster isnt a good experience

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28/Apr/2008, 10:42 am

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johnnytwldcc
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Re: Reopening a can of worms?

At least we can concentrate on Div 6 now CodSkip, not long to go to our big clash emoticon

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28/Apr/2008, 10:44 am

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gilly11
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Re: Reopening a can of worms?

I've always enjoyed the cup comps as they are, its a great chance to test your ability against the best first, second or third teams around.
If you cant get a full strength team out then that's your clubs problem, not a problem with the comp.
Whilst at Gt Ecc we had some great games against sides with pros from higher leagues.
Winning some and losing others, I don't think anyone will forget getting the pro out first ball of the game in one Lancs cup game.
It all makes for good experience.
Juniors should be encouraged to play and learn from these games.
As an older player whose club is in div 2 it would be great to play Vernon's or Eccy in the cup, so you get that chance to play against the top players again.

28/Apr/2008, 11:36 am

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johnnytwldcc
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Re: Reopening a can of worms?

Agreed gilly, but what CodSkip and myself are saying is, sides from the lower divisions should play in a separate competition that doesnt include the big teams. What chance would our 2nd team who are in Div 6 have against Vernons 2nd team?

I relish playing against big teams and maybe getting a giant killing but at the end of day, the chances of beating one of the big teams is minimal at best. The big teams then get an easy route into the next round, and im sure they would rather play against teams of their standard.

Last edited by johnnytwldcc, 28/Apr/2008, 11:58 am

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28/Apr/2008, 11:52 am

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vindz
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Re: Reopening a can of worms?

quote:
johnnytwldcc wrote:

Agreed gilly, but what CodSkip and myself are saying is, sides from the lower divisions should play in a separate competition that doesnt include the big teams. What chance would our 2nd team who are in Div 6 have against Vernons 2nd team?

I relish playing against big teams and maybe getting a giant killing but at the end of day, the chances of beating one of the big teams is minimal at best. The big teams then get an easy route into the next round, and im sure they would rather play against teams of their standard.

Our 2nds (div 5) drew Longridge 2nds (Div 1) last season. you ask them if they enjoyed that.... i dont think any of them enjoyed it in the slightest....

28/Apr/2008, 12:37 pm

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